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Old 10th Jan 2020, 07:48 AM   #1741
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I do like that. I noticed you go back in and chamfer and double. I've always done chamfering and poly density first then I go back and eliminate where I don't need them. I imagine its a matter of how easy it is or isn't to do the chamerfering and poly doubling after the fact in MAX. Admit it's been a while since I've been in LW but it's always been easier to remove than add after the main build in LW.
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Old 10th Jan 2020, 03:50 PM   #1742
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In max it depends on what type of modeling your doing box modeling I chamfer after rough forms are in. But with subdiv all the rounding etc has to be put in at the base mesh level. Max I have found has additional tools like smoothing groups many other software do not have so I can do tighter loops with less surface geo.

Max still in the realm of box modeling seems to be way out of touch or out of date. It lacks a lot of the tools other packages have when it comes to filleting chamfering etc. Max you still have to be aware of geometry and how the edges cross say a area you want to chamfer. If those edges are not exactly 90deg to each other your chamfer will vary in width.
To defeat this I so alot of strange things like insetting faces. I also do this to avoid odd smoothing artifacts if I have those aforementioned smoothing groups set as a single one across a organic shape.

Anyhow on large things that I have in subdiv a chamfer or hard edge or rounded edge is part of the planning process. Sometimes I leave it a hard edge with the intent to chamfer it by hand in a box modeling style. Other times I will prechamfer but not often as it means having to clean up all the edges filling the chamfer out. But more often I just do edge loops and use smoothing groups to tighten them up and remove every other edge as often subdiv adds way too many edges than I really need.

Sometime I think in max 2015 they added a new chamfer tool that allows you to not need to double chamfer in stages to get rounded corners and does it all at once and have control over the curve via a ramp setting but it still is not as good as doing it by hand but I will use it off and on for laziness or to minimize complexity.

That chamfer tool. in the past it just had the amount slot and you just kept applying it to get it "rounder" Results are the red edges and the stuff between. If you look you can see how the gaps are not 100% even. Always been a issue in max cheater tools for chamfers. Also some idiot thinks that default smoothing the whole bloody object on chamfer is a GOOD IDEA, not.


Wire cap of the deflector stuff. Almost all of this is box modeling. The outer frame is the only thing from the original subdiv object.


This one the window frame shows a mix of a optimized collapsed subdiv mesh with box modeling applied to it.
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Old 11th Jan 2020, 08:22 PM   #1743
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More stuff on the deflector. Got lazy so this is a day late. Got hdd maintenance to do today so dunno if I will have anything done, already 6pm and nothing done so heh.



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Old 13th Jan 2020, 04:59 AM   #1744
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Close up from last night and not much else just rcs cut ins.



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Old 13th Jan 2020, 11:00 AM   #1745
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Thank for clarifying how it works for you in MAX. I've used MAX lightly before but been unwilling to learn new software. Anyway, back to the model. Loving the updates as always.
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 01:40 AM   #1746
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RCS I think are done. Some markings to go and maybe tuning to go later on. Need to decide if I will add a further rearward quad as nothing is facing aft. Maybe the nacelles, the lip of the main hull, or even the struts.


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Old 14th Jan 2020, 08:02 AM   #1747
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Lifeboat inset and torp bits. A bit of a tight fit, should have modeled that lip a bit taller. Also redid the rcs to have rounded corners and rounded thrust outlets.


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Old 14th Jan 2020, 02:08 PM   #1748
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Looking at the bottom front view. Those bit on each side of the housing are lifeboats, right? That makes me wonder and ask, how many people do those lifeboats actually hold?
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 06:09 PM   #1749
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8 12? I forget, it is the standard SOV lifeboat. Supposedly they all sit against the walls of the things.
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 07:10 PM   #1750
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Here a 5'8" girl on one. These are just caps, so you do not see the depth to them. Id say interior space would be just outside the innermost panel lines. So 12 could fit in. I forget what the real numbers are.


Mine are not exact either as I left out that curvature as that poly count just goes through the roof on larger ships.

not sure if crew size it listed in that article forget where it was listed.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki...ype_escape_pod
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 09:59 PM   #1751
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Tentative layout of the lifeboats. Maybe I have a bit too many on the upper hull. Real negative is the lack of access to the aft central hull as I have no where to mount them short of the warp cut in the aft bottom. Suppose I coulda done a few less room in the rear A/B deck and stuck one or two there. Cant have them too much further aft on the pylon base as the impulse drives would get in the way ot the pods would mean less structure near the drives leading to weakness.



26 topside 24 below, total of 50X12 per pod =600, easily enough for all crew. I would think this thing would have no more than 300 at any one time. Even at 6per would cover 300. Given you'll likely have losses of 20% or more in a abandon ship scenario. . . .
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Old 14th Jan 2020, 10:46 PM   #1752
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quickie update with planned layout for registry. KIM the reg is just bent, final placing will be done by hand.

Not sure on the ship name, forget why I chose it, in english it means hell.
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Old 15th Jan 2020, 06:29 AM   #1753
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Thanks again, just inquiring minds here.
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Old 15th Jan 2020, 07:56 AM   #1754
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Yeah lifeboats are a pain as the information on the minutiae just is not there.

Looking at the things I might have a few too many.


Think it was a fast patrol boat, been so long since I drew the doodle and started this.

Ok after loads of farting around and rolling my eyes at a pair of phaser strips are in. Not sure if they will not move around later on which will result in more rage anger and eye rolling. Cannot use detached splines as they unevenly deform the base object, so I have to match a even point spline to fit. Then I go to edit it I adjust the front vert on the spline it moves the front of the phaser strip, go to move the REAR vert of the spline it moves the same side of the bloody phaser strip. -_-. I SOOO F*N@G hate splines.





Ignore the hull panel lines as I decided to move them about prior to the phasers and got sidetracked on the phasers. Need to look at other places to break the hull panels than the existing ones. Likely use the phasers themselves as a trough to do so.
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Old 15th Jan 2020, 10:51 PM   #1755
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Really hate the idea of weapons systems on struts and nacelles. I have no choice here as the design really clunks up the view for any hull mounted stuff. Given I have a double hoop arrangement on the struts I do have more meat on the struts than normal. ( a person could walk down a stairwell down them easily) So the surface area and thickness should give me room for the conduits etc. and still keep some distance between the conduit for the warp nacelle plasma and matter transference stuff.


Needless to say aft coverage is a bit meh. 2 strut phasers and one on the butt. I want to avoid messing with the lower struts. The butt mount will eliminate any wrap window plans I had for a voy like under shuttle bay observation room. Had thought to use the strange curve to have wrap around windows, but with a emitter there I do not want windows within a deck of it. heck it will likely eliminate any windows below the shuttle bay.
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Old 16th Jan 2020, 01:58 PM   #1756
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I remember the only startship I designed. Not sure most of us even think about the engineering side of it. Cool that you are thinking those parts through.
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Old 18th Jan 2020, 12:48 AM   #1757
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I find it part of what can sell the ship but it is also from my building exp that I need to plan out volume and parts. Again this is part of why I had chosen trek as all the tech requires certain shapes and form. Probably would have gone for engineering if my maths were not so horrid.

Some paint over ideas. Mostly realizing the era due to the reg number I needed to do more of a post sov detail. Pintover images also show some of the modeling done since last update too (mostly escape pod wells and the like and a new set of lower struts that might get redone again as I was pretty un creative in the cross section on them.


more to come I think as I have the underside to mete out next.
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Old 20th Jan 2020, 06:49 AM   #1758
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Well, engineering or not, I enjoy watching the process. I am actually thinking about doing some modeling again. A design idea I hit upon while browsing some boat pictures of all things. I save off the images and been thinking about the idea itself. Things like scale, function, technology, etc. Won't be trek, it would be something completely new, unthought of. But for now, it's an idea and watching your process has me looking at it a little differently this time.
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Old 21st Jan 2020, 01:13 PM   #1759
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erm my last post I guess never made it to the server. . . though it looked like it posted heh


white piping on the upper dark bits.




missing post.
Quote:
HDW distractions have slowed work but roughing in the panels to see how I like them on the model. The flow of the dark panels going across the struts I am not so sure on atm but will wait until I get the white markings in as it could clarify the pattern better. BUT I might be removing the bits that are flowing towards the ships back end.



One area I have not decided what I want to do or how I will manage things is the backside of the saucer where I have a pair of pulse phaser emitters poking out a bit. Have a rolled hull plating to a opening for greebs like the back side hull of the iowa? or just roll the panels right across the face and have it smooth as seen as it is now. Something to mull over I guess.
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Old 21st Jan 2020, 01:52 PM   #1760
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On the back pulse phasers. IMO,they look like they belong atm. I guess it depends more on what you think looks best but they work for me.
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Old 21st Jan 2020, 02:23 PM   #1761
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Well they are just half sticking out and being occluded by the hull. The debate is to leave that hull as is and just make panels on or to do like what I did with the backsides of the IOWA.


have the hull wrap around like it dows around the impulse and other bits in that "channel"

Likely have it stay the way it is and make some details to house those aft emitters and some windows or something back there.
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Old 21st Jan 2020, 03:50 PM   #1762
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Ok, I see your point. I have to admit the IOWA looks really nice the way it's done.
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Old 22nd Jan 2020, 12:34 AM   #1763
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Yeah I just have to mull it over and make a few attempts at something at some point. >_>

Remaining dark panels.
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Old 22nd Jan 2020, 09:28 PM   #1764
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Laying out grids, these will be shallow extrusions later on. Also extruding out the rim panels. These will be sub paneled like the ones on the SOV. (basically what I have done for all my late TNG stuff.)

after this probably do the bottom or get to making a decision on the backside bits of the saucer.
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Old 23rd Jan 2020, 06:03 AM   #1765
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The little sub panels in and the sensor insets on the rim are done, need to get around to bending the greebles into them later on. I need to locate the asset file for them. I had thought to do something other than Voyager like rounded slots but just made the round Voyager like pits in the end. might undo them and have another go. We will see. Also knocked in the docking port into those cut outs.



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Old 23rd Jan 2020, 08:37 AM   #1766
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When you say assets. It sounds like you keep a set of items which you reuse?
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Old 23rd Jan 2020, 07:49 PM   #1767
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oops I typed a reply but it vanished. . . . anyhow mentioned how I pinch parts off older models so I have a resource of generic parts like lifeboats, phaser parts torp launchers etc. Issue is I do not have a folder full of files so I generally have to go source em off a older project. Luckily the sensors were saved out as a unique file so they were easier to find than I expected.
UPDATE:
Sensor doodas in. Might have to alter materials some as I just replaced a few from the stock stuff. Need to go around and redo all the materials in the older files.

Applied darker materials as the test render of just the sensors looked to light but oddly once placed in the ship they now look too dark! heh. oh well.

Reminds me I probably will round off the chamfers on the pits the sensors sit in atm it is a single chamfer. They were pretty soft on the voy and other ships other than the Galaxy. (well sov and galaxy were just grooves mostly)


different material on the base parts.
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Old 24th Jan 2020, 06:29 AM   #1768
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Stuck a docking port in the nose ala Voyager. Not sure if I will follow through with it. Had to adjust out all the locking brackets as the one on Voyager were doors with all that behind. Also rounded out the pits more.

Altered the REG number as well.


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Old 24th Jan 2020, 07:42 AM   #1769
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Thanks for the details. My projects always seem to be one off items so I don't seem to have an easy repository. I often end up looking at other designs to glen ideas and find tidbits which look like they would fit to my ideas. Then it's build them up and work them in.
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Old 24th Jan 2020, 11:12 PM   #1770
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Well I do have non trek items I resource once in a while. But often it is elements that are unique to thier universes. EG BSG My own stuff various anime etc. But I still have a few generic things like furnishings and guns as long as they can be used for the project. I had a bunch of appliances I made at one point for doing buildings and stuff but heh dunno where they are anymore.



Update:

More nose work and some additional plates to even out the rim plating. A bit dodgy in the modeling but you need to get really close in to see it. Good old extruding off a compound curve and needing rounded features across that curve. >_>

Been looking at voyager pics to get ideas of markings etc but never realized my Voyager folder is so sparse. Almost all I have is what you see at ex-astris. I would think the ship would have gotten more than 2 semi fuzzy flash photos from christies or least a set of decent modern digital shots in about that timeframe but all I can find are the 2 seen at ex-astris. T_T
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/scans/intrepid1.htm
originally went looking for images of the markinfs just above the forward docking port. Almost all the non digital images are so grainy and jpged up you loose the detail of that area of the ship or it is cropped off. Avoiding anything with the cgi model as it lacked a lot of markings and of course the "experience" model as that was just whack period. Heck I get more results for people's kit builds and scratch builds than I do the studio model.

What is funny is I reference Voyager a lot for all those funny decals over the years and just never noticed how few refs there are. Most are fuzzy magazine scans from the late 90s.

oh I do have a few small images that Doug posted at drexfiles way back but all of the wrong areas of the model.
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